Author Topic: Storms across SE Aust (incl Melbourne hailstorm & Shepparton storm) 4 - 10 March 2010  (Read 33549 times)

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Offline Jeff Brislane

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Just heard through the Bureau grapevine that the 10cm hailstone reported in Melbourne is actually factual. Was recorded by a BOM observer at home (Classic case of Work following you home).


I didn't know that all BoM observors also work at the BoM.  ;)

Seriously though I think you've nailed this on the head when you mentioned the BoM "grapevine". They seem to be not only full of all sorts of mis-information but they are often the propogators of said information. I think they (BoM meteorologist) should have to move every two years to a new office to get a better perspective and understanding about severe weather.

As for 10cm hailstones show us the photo with the ruler or stop talking about the possibility. I experienced the Blacktown Classic Supercell event of a couple years ago which produced up to 9cm hailstones and you know what, 8-9cm is big enough to smash roofs and cars and just about everything else. Lets remember that 8-9cm from a supercell in Melbourne is amazing and significant and so lets stand in awe of that instead of trying to constanly enhance and stretch the evidence.

Regards Jeff.

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Hi Enak,

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I think with a bit of melting it could have approached the 10cm mark?

The question is - did it? the visual evidence to me suggest the hailstone is virtually intact with minimal melting so if it appears 9cm, then that is the nearest approximation. The middle one has definitely had melting.

My initial query was centred on the fact that the atmosphere did not seem to support such massive hailstones in my opinion. I am even surprised that 8 - 9cm was spawned despite the thermodynamics. This is why I believe that the collapsing of the storm phase may have lead to the hailstones of this size. I guess it is usually the weakening of the updraft that allows for the suspended hailstones to finally reach the ground.

John, what was the swathe path length of hailstones with diameters say greater than 8cm?

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Lets remember that 8-9cm from a supercell in Melbourne is amazing and significant and so lets stand in awe of that instead of trying to constanly enhance and stretch the evidence.

Totally agree Jeff. I recall chatting to Michael Bath when we first began chasing about how infrequent hailstorms with hail say 7cm or greater actually were in the Bureau database.

The widespread nature of this event may see this event 11 years on from the Sydney hailstorm challenge its status as the most devastating hailstorm. Rumour has it that already 25,000 vehicles have been set aside for repairs from 3 insurance companies alone.

Regards

Jimmy Deguara
« Last Edit: 14 March 2010, 03:46:00 PM by Jimmy Deguara »
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Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Hi John,

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From what i've seen and heard the damage path is fairly long and intense, but relatively narrow

That is a fairly general statement - could you be more specific about what you have seen... and heard? I am specifically talking about hail sizes say greater than 8cm - how long was this swathe?

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we sort of didnt realise/fully appreciate its significance until we reviewed the funnel it produced and saw the dynamics in cloud motion (I only saw the hook echo and couplet and thought nothing of it lol)...

Really - I wouldn't have though nothing of it! What if it produced a tornado?

Regards,

Jimmy Deguara
« Last Edit: 15 March 2010, 02:41:10 AM by Jimmy Deguara »
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Offline Shaun Galman

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Hi guys,

What a beast of a storm system this was! I can't believe I didn't get anything from it lol! I was in Albury at that time marveling at the radar signature with some friends of mine wondering and debating if we should head out into the mix. From the damage reports I'm kind of glad we didn't.
Seeing the supercell looming over Melbourne on the news was amazing! Such a beautiful structure and very well defined on the front edge.

We ended up down in the Buckland Valley (just West of Bright in VIC) a few days later and we were greeted by spectacular waterfalls in full effect coming off of Mt. Buffalo. I wish I had my camera handy but we were gold prospecting at the time.

I recall an Albury local telling me they received around 68mm from that system. We didn't see any storms hit the Albury area but did hear the odd thunder rumble amongst the low cloud and rain.

Great reports, photos and video as usual :D

Take care,
Shauno.
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Offline ross

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Here is a link to the picks taken in Shepparton on the 7th. Also included are some images from Lake Boga taken on my way back home to Adelaide. The system that looks like a tunnel was west of Echuca these are from the 8th.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossfelix/sets/72157623490947575/

Offline Peter J

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Hi all,

I was actually surprised to see the footage of the storm when it hit FTG, as I live only 10-15kms away, in Mooroolbark - we got 26mm in 25 mins from the supercell storm, but no hail... I have friends who live in Central FTG (for the Vic observers, they live in Bruce St, near the Railway station) and they had heard to storm coming (the typical "freight-train" like noise), and also encountered large hailstones making sporadic "bonk" noises off the tin roof moments before the storm let fly. This noise they heard, could it have possible been the sound of an approaching tornado? Any other views?

Peter J (Big P)

PS - the storm did get an amazing "greenage" to the south of my home - and to the post about tornado warnings, they should be included in Melbourne's severe warning set up - coz we do get these type of storms from time to time.. my memory is November 1983 hailstorm that destroyed parts of Croydon, Mooroolbark and Mt Evelyn... one memory that remains with me to this day...
PJJ

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Hi Ross,

Looks like you had a fantastic and extensive shelf cloud certainly resulting from those very powerful winds.

Regards,

Jimmy Deguara
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Offline Michael Thomas

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I have friends who live in Central FTG (for the Vic observers, they live in Bruce St, near the Railway station) and they had heard to storm coming (the typical "freight-train" like noise), and also encountered large hailstones making sporadic "bonk" noises off the tin roof moments before the storm let fly. This noise they heard, could it have possible been the sound of an approaching tornado? Any other views?

I would say this noise was the sound of hail hitting roofs and other surfaces. I have heard what you described once before in the 1999 Sydney hailstorm (but south of Wollongong when it crossed the coast). First I heard the sound of the odd stone hitting roofs followed by a roar of the approaching 'wall of hail.'

Michael

Offline Michael Bath

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Looks like a few cricket balls (7cm) in there.  Nice to see a clip without all the hysterics too - just the sound of large hail.   No strong winds in that location (where ever it was).



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Offline Brad Hannon

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Certainly some big stones in that front yard!

Here are a few pic my mum took from her balcony (looking WSW towards where the CBD can usually be seen!) as the storm front moved in.  Obviously the big hail is still suspended above.  Some interesting features and structure can be seen.

hmmm June 2nd......

Offline Brad Hannon

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On another note, at work I deal a lot with asbestos related issues in workplaces including asbestos cement roofs which dont take too kindly to large hail.  Yesterday a colleague of mine showed me photos of hail damage to the roof of a very large brickworks in Scoresby, which interestingly is 5-6km further west of the residential areas such as Lysterfield that got hit so hard. 

The size of the brickworks can be seen in google map but im told the main building is over 150m long, 40mwide and quite tall (guessing 15m+) and the entire roof is asbestos cement material.

http://maps.google.com.au/maps?q=-37.887115,145.211964&num=1&t=h&sll=-37.899146,145.232992&sspn=0.035223,0.06403&gl=au&ie=UTF8&ll=-37.886235,145.212135&spn=0.044031,0.091238&z=14

The photos show an incredible number of very large holes punched through the roof and I'm talking potentially many hundreds and i'm talking many to the size of cricket balls.  Then of course there is the contamination and water damage that followed.  The entire plant has been shut down for asbestos decontamination and subsequently for plastic to be placed over the machinery to allow asbestos removalists to remove the entire roof above without further contamination.  This is likely to take a month.

I hope to share the photos but at this stage I do not have permission as they were taken by the building owner.

Regards,
Brad.
hmmm June 2nd......

Offline Brad Hannon

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Friday March 5th 2010 - pics of flooding on Bendigo's western outskirts:
hmmm June 2nd......

Offline Brad Hannon

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Various stitched wide angle panoramics of the storms that followed the backbuilding line that soaked Bendigo:

« Last Edit: 24 March 2010, 05:11:27 PM by Brad Hannon »
hmmm June 2nd......

Offline Brad Hannon

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2 more stitched wide angle pano's west of Bendigo:
hmmm June 2nd......

Offline Brad Hannon

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Impressive inflow was on the menu this evening with some inflow bands stretching 180 degrees behind us as well as these curving bands:

 
hmmm June 2nd......