Author Topic: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina  (Read 10416 times)

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Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« on: 10 September 2009, 01:36:41 AM »
It seems there has just been some violent storms with a tornado killing a woman in Brazil. Overall, 15 people dead in the reports so far.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h61-3gp8PfCUXW5fQWj9v2TVha5QD9AJBRC80

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Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #1 on: 10 September 2009, 04:47:57 AM »
The only real images of the tornado to date is the sat image,( I thought I had tracked down 2 photos and started to post them, but upon further investigating they proved to be from previous tornadoes, they just did not match up with the report.  shows you have to be careful !)

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #2 on: 10 September 2009, 08:28:26 AM »
Colin,

If I cannot verify that this event actually occurred, this thread will be removed. I also cannot find any reference from Youtube of the event.

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Jimmy Deguara
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Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #3 on: 10 September 2009, 09:30:55 AM »
Jimmy, it seems the whole world is reporting it, from Russia to Australia. The images that the some "news" sites are using seem to appear from previous storms, but still no photos except for one of a bike under some rubble and NOAA sat image  that the Argentinian weather bureau showed of the system .

Caption reads : A motor bike lies underwood near San Pedro, in Misiones province, Argentina, Tuesday Sept. 08, 2009. A violent storm that spawned a tornado has killed at least 15 people across northern Argentina, authorities said Tuesday. (AP Photo/Ramon Gonzalez-El Territorio )

But it could of been caused by strong wind.

Something might pop up.
 

Cheers
Col

Offline Peter J

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #4 on: 10 September 2009, 10:41:20 AM »
This is an article from news.com.au about the Argentine "Tornado":

World Breaking News 
South America storm kills 14
From correspondents in Buenos AiresAgence France-PresseSeptember 09, 2009 04:57am+-PrintEmailShare
A FIERCE storm described in places as a "tornado" shredded hundreds of houses and killed at least 14 people in the southern part of South America overnight, officials said.
Argentina, Brazil and Paraguay were all hit by the cold front packing rain, hail and winds over 100km/h.

In northeastern Argentina, near the border with the two other countries, 10 people died, including seven children, authorities said.

More than 50 others were injured, and trees and power lines were toppled in the towns of Santa Rosa, Tobuna and Pozo Azul, said Ricardo Veselka Corrales, head of the local civil defence office.

Several local media reports described the storm as a tornado, but meteorologists called it a severe depression, where tropical warm air and frigid air collide to create instability.

Provincial minister Daniel Franco described the storm as "out of the ordinary in this region".

The devastation was "incredible", said the mayor of San Pedro, Orlando Wolfart.

"This is something we've never seen," he said, noting that several homes had been wiped from their foundations.

Television images showed swathes of a destroyed landscape, with several homes levelled and others still standing but with their roofs ripped off. Argentina's Health Minister Juan Manzur was to travel to the region.

In the southern Brazilian state of Santa Catarina, four people died when winds knocked over 90 houses.

The state's civil defence service said at least another 64 people were hurt, 40 of whom were hospitalised. Another 370 homes suffered damage.

One town in the state, Sao Domingos, was isolated, while several others had water and electricity supplies cut.

The head of the service, Major Marcio Luiz Alves, said "the real extent of the damage will be known in the next few hours".

In Sao Paulo, Latin America's biggest city, the storm turned the sky so dark that it appeared to be night, with occasional bolts of lightning and the persistent rumbling of thunder.

Heavy rain caused flooding in 28 spots around the city and brought normally congested roads to a standstill.

The G1 news website said pilots of airliners arriving at Sao Paulo's main domestic airport of Congonhas were forced to land using instruments because of zero visibility. More than a dozen flights were delayed.

In Paraguay, hail stones peppered roofs and damaged about 700 rural properties.

"Damage was registered in the areas of Neembucu, San Pedro, Paraguari, Cordillera, Canindeyu and Caaguazu. Many crops were damaged, according to initial reports," the risk manager for the country's emergency service, Aldo Saldivar, said.

The change in weather saw temperatures in the capital Asuncion suddenly plunge from 35 degrees celsius to 12 degrees.

(Courtesy: News.com.au)

Big Pete
PJJ

Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #5 on: 10 September 2009, 11:54:14 AM »
More images are emerging now, if you can understand Argentinian ( Spanish?) this is the news footage showing some of the devastation  http://www.clarin.com/diario/2009/09/08/um/m-01994439.htm        I dont know if this would be a permanent link or how to make it one.

And this photo has come from the same site

You have to dig deep for this one and try different combinations of wording and adjusting date to American standard mm/dd/yy


Col

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #6 on: 10 September 2009, 05:07:14 PM »
Colin,

Yes it could have been strong straight line winds although Brazil is not stranger to tornadoes. However, on close examination of the photograph I took note of the peeled corrugated iron. A piece of corrugated iron has been ripped from the right hand side of the shed and then another piece of iron is folded over towards the right.  This to me seems more consistent with inflow jets though we require more photographic shots. One part of the shed has been destroyed whilst the other part remains mostly intact which seems inconsistent with straight line winds. The part of the shed that has been collapsed is very chaotic with snapped beams etc.

The distant background and immediately behind the shed shows snapped trees. I would certainly not rule out tornado here.

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Jimmy Deguara
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Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #7 on: 11 September 2009, 01:35:50 AM »
You tube footage showing the damage caused by the tornado in Brazil  Raw Video: Tornado Kills 15 in Argentina, Brazil

Col

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #8 on: 11 September 2009, 01:58:53 AM »
The damage in that video to me definitely indicates tornadic damage.

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Jimmy Deguara
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Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #9 on: 11 September 2009, 04:04:01 AM »
I have posted a google map of the terrain to highlight the location and its probable isolation, it would explain the time it has taken to get reports and imagery from the province. Sat images show it to be surrounded by forrests. The posted picture may be that of the cell as it approached the area, it was posted with the news report, but not sure, reason for saying this, is the storm is reported to have intensified and hit between 8:30- 9:00 pm at night, which may also be a reason for a lack of imagery of the storm system.

The picture posted is from the same source   http://momento24.com/en/2009/09/08/misiones-province-affected-by-deadly-tornadoes/

This is an article from a local source called  
Misiones province affected by deadly tornadoes
Posted on 08 September 2009 at 10:37


Authorities in the province reported that rescue teams from Oberá, El Dorado, San Vicente and Bernardo de Irigoyen were working with the help of  National Gendarmerie forces stationed in the area, municipalities of San Pedro, Irigoyen and Civil Defense. Santa Rosa,  Colonia and El Progreso were the most affected villages. The number of fatal victims had not yet been determined.

The police report indicates that the tragic tornado that struck the area , knocking down trees and houses in its path, with a tragic toll of at least 10 deaths, leaving also 18 people seriously injured and 40 with minor injuries.

Ernesto Orlando Wolfart, San Pedro village Community chief said: “houses have vanished, forrests, it is incredible, never seen.”

The strong winds and the rain started between 8:30 and 9 pm. It was a tornado never seen in this area, at least not remembered.


Col
 
« Last Edit: 11 September 2009, 04:15:02 AM by Colin Maitland »

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #10 on: 11 September 2009, 08:00:12 AM »
Am I correct in assuming that Brazil is in the Southern Hemisphere? If that is the case, then this storm to be tornadic does not seem t fit the picture being a right mover. Well very rarely do right moving supercells produce tornadoes in the Southern Hemisphere. See if any other pictures or videos come through.

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Offline Michael Thomas

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #11 on: 11 September 2009, 09:00:58 AM »
I was thinking the same thing, that last photo doesn't quite look right. It wouldn't surprise me if that photo was taken in the US. Anyway, I have tried to dig up some data but unfortunately there is some problems with the server. Would I be right in thinking that this event happen on the 8th around 0Z. Here is a sounding from Southern Brazil taken at 12Z 7th September-

http://weather.uwyo.edu/cgi-bin/sounding?region=samer&TYPE=GIF%3ASKEWT&YEAR=2009&MONTH=09&FROM=0712&TO=0712&STNM=83971

Nothing amazing there but the lapse rate is quite steep from 800 to 300 mbar. Warming and moistening of the lower levels would be expected to have increased CAPE substantially. An approaching upper level trough likely improved the wind profile too.

Michael


Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #12 on: 11 September 2009, 10:51:02 AM »
The more I thought about the attached photo of the cell to the related article (as seen below), the more I feel it is not that of the storm system that hit.
Reasons
 A: It appears to be afternoon where as the storm struck around 8:30pm at night and being in the Southern hemisphere and the given the distance away from the equator it would be dark.
B: the terrain does not appear to match that of Misiones province which is mountainous ( that's where the mud slides would have come into affect.) and also  the lack of forestry
and, C) the rotation of the Storm as stated.  


I found this to be the case all the way through trying to find information, I think that the media was just slapping any photo on hoping no one would know or think any the better there off.

(If you feel the same about the 2 pictures and it breaks the integrity and accuracy of this site please feel free to remove them.)

Col

Offline Jimmy Deguara

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #13 on: 11 September 2009, 11:05:00 AM »
Coming to think of it, the photograph looks quite similar to the South Dakota tornadic supercell in 2005 June 7th to be precise.

http://www.australiasevereweather.com/photography/pictures/2005/0607jd17.html




http://www.australiasevereweather.com/photography/pictures/2005/0607jd16.html



Regards,

Jimmy Deguara

« Last Edit: 11 September 2009, 11:53:23 AM by Michael Bath »
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Offline Colin Maitland

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Re: Tornado and Severe Storms Brazil and Argentina
« Reply #14 on: 11 September 2009, 11:12:42 AM »
Everyone that knows me says I have a "photographic memory" and I was sure that I had seen that cell on the net somewhere before, it had been bugging me all day.

Thanks

Col